User talk:Auron/UnlockFirst/Elementalist/Archive

r u euro? is that why u like bsurge? c/d? --Readem 23:16, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

Aside from bsurge being the best skill in the game... sure. -Auron 15:00, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

It is a terrible skill in comparison to Ineptitude ;/. The only reason I would bring a bsurge, would be for WaM, Bolt, and perhaps draw. Due to the necessity of a partygon (unless your guild splits constantly), there is simply no room left (except maybe in rawrspike). --Readem 05:04, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Don't bother posting on my pages, Readem. I hardly ever agree with you, and this is no exception.

Bsurge is several times better than ineptitude. Ineptitude is used more now because of "sineptitude," which combines the imbaness of sin splits with hex shutdown at stand. Bsurge is a better skill for causing blind and is a better skill for shutdown in general. Ineptitude is only decent when combined with Clumsiness and a slew of other hexes (and while played in a hex-heavy build). Alone, ineptitude is shit. Alone, Bsurge is the best skill in the game that people can tack more utility onto.

And where on earth is your logic? You claim people can't fit bsurges into party builds anymore, but they can somehow fit hex mesmers? Really, that's silly. People fit hex mesmers in hex builds - not in balanced. I couldn't care less what some bad, scrubby japanese guilds run because they're too terrible to out-skill anyone in the top 100. -Auron 11:15, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Regardless, bsurge is outdated. No one cares about its utility (except perhaps GANK/rawr). Now that LoD has been nerfed to shit, you either split or partygon. Hexway is prevalent in the current metagame, due to the HEV nerf. Why do think sineptitude is so powerful? Sure, you can blind a war while he is unloading, but you will eventually be diverted. Ineptitude can not only be spammed on rec, but prevents pressure in-general.

• You cannot frenzy
• You cannot unload
• You cannot bull's
• They have a shitload of healing
• Unless you collapse on the split (impossible on certain maps), you are going to be raped at VoD by archers that can fucking solo the lord.
• People can fit 3 ineptitude's np. One can even flag with pious.

Reasons why DF/dR (the only guilds running balanced who are good, the rest are shitty eurospike) win?

• They split every game
• Both have a 4/4 split strategy and can revert to vD balanced
• No member is limited to stand

Reasons why bsurge is bad:

• Good Mesmers will have np diverting it (just watch the ele, and see his trigger. Frenzy, bull's, ect)
• Not very effective on the split (cripshot will mend the wars ect)
• Expensive
• Not useful at VoD (which wins now btw)
• Primarily used in eurospike w/ a partygon (for 321 spikes)
• Lose the ability to snare (unless you drop partygon which is lolfail for a build strong at stand)

Your comment about Ineptitude vs Bsurge is illogical Auron. Sure, Panic is a bad skill alone as well. However, when combined w/ Corrupt and Migraine, it is rather effective. What do you not understand about the game auron? There is very little skill involved anymore (unless t-space suddenly became difficult)? Oh, and last time I checked, [sup] was running sineptitude to farm ladder. They must be a scrub r2 european guild. lulz --Readem 03:19, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Bsurge not being run doesn't make it any worse of a skill. Cry of Frustration is an amazing skill, but because nobody runs caster spikes, nobody runs Cry. Does that make it bad? Uh... no. Unless it falls out of the meta due to nerfs, it is every bit as powerful as it once was. And no, the game hasn't progressed beyond physicals being the only way to kill stuff (and, imo, it never will), so the potential is still there.

Bsurge has a shorter recharge and hits AoE (if you don't suck at targeting), so not only can it stop adren spikes every time, it can "prevent pressure in-general" just as well if not better than Ineptitude.

People still care about Bsurge's utility - but as you said, since party healing is such a bitch to get (thanks to anet's harebrained LoD nerf), partygons are more common. That doesn't make bsurge any less useful, it just means people are forced to run party healing on an offmonk slot (and since bsurges simply cannot do party healing without severely crippling their blind potential, bsurges are uncommon). And really, I don't see Ineptitude mesmers bringing heal party or PwK, so your point is moot.

Hexway is prevalent in the current metagame because bad players are prevalent in current mATs. Bad players run hex builds because it's their only way to win, and since ANet is too inept (lol c wut i did thur) to add decent hex removal (read - minimum 5r, with more benefits like Cure Hex's huge heal), it's going to be a steady way to win because nobody that cares about their reputation will ever run hexes.

Why is sineptitude so powerful? Uh, let me think. Oh, right, because it's motherfucking imbalanced. Sins are imba. Shadowsteps are imba. Hexes are imba. Illusion Magic is imba (although I don't expect you'll be able to see why; ask Alex sometime, and if he can breathe between laughs, he'll explain it). On top of that, are any of those hard to run? No, they aren't. Sin bars are target-1-2-3-4-5, mesmer bars are "I'm using Clumsiness on Enemy Warrior (1)!" Shadowstepping allows people who are bad at the game to split better than pros. How else could [Me] have beaten [cE], who are far superior players? They just shadowstep out and play cat-and-mouse the entire game. It isn't hard when your bar is stupidly broken. Again, [Me] didn't out-skill [cE], they out builds-wars'd them, which is not what Guild Wars is supposed to be about.

I don't really see what your first bulleted list is about, unless you're just trying to back up my claim that hexes are imbalanced and require no skill to play. Your last point makes me laugh, however; you've obviously missed when people ran two or three Bsurges and rolled teams every bit as much as sineptitude does. QQ pugs used to run dual/triple bsurge with two teleporting dervs that would spike every 10 seconds. Bsurge alleviated all pressure and orbed every spike, and the dervs applied deep wound. GANK surprised the hell out of everyone with dual bsurge, dual (dom) mes GvG build - so much defense they'd just wait till VoD and win via npc advantage and tons of impossible-to-diversion defense (you know the logic you use to claim bsurge is bad? Yeah, it's only avoidable when you run multiple copies of a single skill). Familiar build concept? Oh, damn, it's exactly the same! Six characters devoted to defense that let their party live till VoD then win. Dual bsurge did it back then, but you need three ineptitudes to do it now...

I don't understand your point about DF and dR. They're good players. They can play in different styles. [Me] aren't good players. They can play only one style - which just happens to be unimaginably broken.

"Reasons why bsurge is bad:"

• Ineptitude can be diversioned just as easily as Bsurge. Clumsiness more so. I don't see how that makes a skill bad.
• You mean it can't split with a monk and a sin to kill stuff? Aside from that being flat wrong, I guess that somehow means it sucks. I had no idea we judged skills based on the performance of a totally different mechanically driven build (hexes). I guess I'll keep that in mind. (Note to self: any skill worse than the single most broken build in the game (not even skill, as ineptitude is shit without clumsiness and imagined and a monk and a sin on the split) is automatically bad).
• Expensive? When Ineptitude and Clumsiness are both the same cost but come without attunes? Uh, okay. (You might try to argue that mesmers have inspiration; they do indeed, but they have to spec it. Attunes are spec-free, as they come in whatever elemental you're already speccing.)
• Not useful at VoD? So you mean hitting the pre-protted war (or guard) with bsurge and blinding the entire mob of archers isn't very useful? K, whatever you say. I guess dealing 50-60 damage to said PS'd war (and blinding only him) is so much better. And if he isn't PS'd, bsurge is going to be hitting for 100+ anyway - but a lot more often.
• So because bad players use it in eurospike, the skill is bad? Uh, I'm not following your logic. The skill's use and utility is not affected by how many people use it (a point I've touched on already; remember Cry?).
• You lose the ability to snare? What the hell are you talking about, seriously? Imagined burden is only a good snare in a hex build. It's shit otherwise. 15e? 30 second recharge? Honestly, that's a terrible skill. It's only decent when it stays on for its entire duration because of the shitload of other hexes covering it. In any non-hex build (read; one that requires skill), bad hex snares like Imagined would be removed immediately, which is why people use stuff like Freezing Gust. Just because you put snares on the mes in sineptitude doesn't mean you can't put them on something else when playing balanced :/

And re-read your last paragraph, as you seem to have inadvertently supported my claim. Yes, Panic is bad. Yes, by combining any elite hex spell (even ones like Life Transfer) with stuff like Migraine, you get a build that kills. Unfortunately for your argument, nobody combines bsurge with hex builds because 1. it requires skill to play (no skill is a pre-req for hex players) and 2. bsurge works with an entirely different mechanic (hint; anything but hexes).

Lastly, bsurge can (single-handedly) shut down entire enemy offenses, often including the ranger at stand. No ineptitude mesmer can do that. Hence people running, y'know, three copies of it.

In conclusion... Blinding Surge is a better skill than Ineptitude. Ineptitude causes about three times the damage of Bsurge but recharges about five times slower. The shorter recharge is also a boon, because no monk is going to let the blind sit on the war 24/7; bsurge being re-applied will keep the warrior blind for longer. Bsurge also blinds AoE, which is (one of) Ineptitude's major drawbacks. I am not arguing that balanced with bsurge is more powerful than sineptitude, because it isn't; but bsurge is several times better than ineptitude. -Auron 12:37, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

P.S. Three more points. Firstly, ANet's incredible ability to fuck up VoD never ceases to amaze me. As if sineptitude weren't imbalanced before...

Secondly, hexes are simply overpowered. Combining Ineptitude (a meh skill) with actually overpowered hexes (Clumsiness, for the most part) is where the "ouch" comes from. To be honest, Bsurge could replace Ineptitude (Me/E, still with clumsiness) in a "sineptitude" build and outperform it amazingly. The only bitch would be triple speccing (and attune would probably not be feasible on a mes, but it shouldn't really matter as he'd have inspiration).

Lastly, no matter how bad a player you may be, you can't deny that Bsurge is in the upper echelon of Elementalist skills. And since this "project" is about getting the best Ele skills without wasting balth faction on the bad ones, that's really all the reasoning I need to list it. Please use my talk page if you wish to discuss this further. -Auron 12:37, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Where's the flare? —ǥrɩɳsɧƴɖɩđđɭɘş 11:51, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

bsurge owns — Skadiddly[슴Mc슴]Diddles 19:39, 17 February 2008 (UTC)