Guild Wars Wiki talk:Projects/User birthdays/Archive1

Initial discussion

I love this idea :D - anja 12:48, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Very nice ideed! -- (Tribina / talk) 12:50, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Credit goes to also goes to People of Antioch you might wanna change that sentence :p I wasn't allowed to change anything outside the blue part ;-) -- (Tribina / talk) 12:57, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Why change it? --Shadowphoenix 13:13, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

This is blatantly an effort to steal personal information and attain world domination. World domination is an honourable goal, however. Lord of all tyria 13:18, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Um......ok.....I am just trying to be nice --Shadowphoenix 13:20, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Might want to add that signing just the name can be done with ~~~. Lord of all tyria 13:21, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Pffff, the 3 tildes gives you the name and link, without a date or w/e. That's what I did putting mine in. Lord of all tyria 13:23, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

This is actually more popular than I thought it was going to be lol --Shadowphoenix 13:24, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

What you get for messaging everyone and anyone about it :D Lord of all tyria 13:25, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

You made the critical mistake of mentioning it on Gaile Grey's talk page, what did you think would happen? --BramStoker (talk, contribs) 13:27, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

I dont mind it im just saying i didnt think it would get this popular, but now that I realize that I put it on a famous wiki page lol jk --Shadowphoenix 13:30, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

"Might want to add that signing just the name can be done with ~~~." - No you cannot. ~~~ gives the signature not the name. poke | talk 13:32, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Fine, it works if you aren't cool enough to have a non default sig. ^^ Lord of all tyria 13:34, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Yeah and I wanted apologize for "spamming" people about this lol It was late i didnt have coffee and I wasn't thinking straight lol, and i think it is a good idea --Shadowphoenix 13:36, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Credit goes to also goes to People of Antioch --> Two times goes to is a bit too much I think, Credit also goes to xxx it should be ;-).. just trying to help out on this great page ;-) -- (Tribina / talk) 13:59, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

It's actually a great way of seeing who's really active in wiki! I can even stalk some of the user pages now! hahaha Renin 14:47, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

(╥_─)Oh noez...... §♦♣♠•◘○-- Ninja Dragon 09:38, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

november

lol @ lonely month XD - Y0_ich_halt 16:00, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Y0 winz the wiki. 34th of November ftw! --  (CoRrRan / talk) 16:24, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

and february 30th. - Y0_ich_halt 16:31, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Ahhh lol i might need some help with this --Shadowphoenix 16:34, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

lol@brains XD he removed my november 34th but not the febrary 30th XD - Y0_ich_halt 16:37, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Every time I look at recent changes someone has added a name lol this is gonna be tough lol --Shadowphoenix 16:38, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

ya, have fun! XD - Y0_ich_halt 16:40, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

I feel a template coming on lol --Shadowphoenix 16:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

plaese don't. that would really suck. - Y0_ich_halt 16:51, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Lol at y0 and me. And February must have been a lonely year month. If you know what I mean. -- Brains12 \ Talk 17:06, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

lmao --Shadowphoenix 17:07, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Lonely month or year? And we all understand, I hope. Calor 17:32, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

I think he means that November was a lonley month XD --Shadowphoenix 17:36, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

ha its been up for a day and already has 695 views lol --Shadowphoenix 17:45, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

I just realized that brains took 9 months into account if u get my drift so he was tight feb. was lonley. --Shadowphoenix 13:54, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

why should feb be the lonely month? it has 7 entries while november has only 2 o.O - Y0_ich_halt 14:08, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

You have to consider nine months --Shadowphoenix 14:10, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

what exactly is that supposed to mean? the loneliest month is that one (not nine o.O) month with the least entries. which is still november. how do you get to nine? - Y0_ich_halt 14:12, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

It takes nine months for a birthday to happen --Shadowphoenix 14:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

that's a different way of interpretation. - Y0_ich_halt 14:19, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Lonely time. Births aren't lonely times,...other actions aren't lonely, but lack of said actions may be considered lonely. Calor 16:15, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

the absence of entries is called lonely in this case. - Y0_ich_halt 16:57, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Restyle

I sorta restyled the tables a bit so the headings are aligned and there are section edit links. May have missed some of your birthdays out while I've been doing it, so put them in if I have. It's not much, but it'll help with editing the months seperately. -- Brains12 \ Talk 16:38, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, you kicked me out, lad! But no bad idea this was, had to scroll all through the edit screen to find May....--Aquila Noctis 18:59, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I did think I missed a few out :/ --[[Image:User Brains12 Shttp://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/Y0_ich_halt

My contributionspiral.png|15px| ]] Brains12 \ Talk 19:02, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

this teal is ugly imo. - Y0_ich_halt 20:29, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

I just picked two basic colors last night. I'll change soon. Calor 21:12, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

"This user page is best viewed with Internet Explorer. It's ok on Mozilla Firefox." - Why using then round borders? o.O poke | talk 21:14, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Because I made it on FireFox with moz border radius, and Shadowphoenix immediately assumes FF is horrible. Calor 21:15, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

tbh, i think it looks better in ff. - Y0_ich_halt 21:19, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Everything is better in ff ;) Calor 21:29, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

but it doesn't look better with -moz-border. - Y0_ich_halt 21:33, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Eh, whatever. Anyways, Shadowphoenix (I really need a short nickname for you), I changed the color theme to light yellows. Calor 21:38, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

You can call me Shadow if u want thats what i go by in-game, and ff i udderly horrible btw --Shadowphoenix 22:38, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Hey! I'm on here as credit, didn't expect that! Anyway, it's my pleasure to help out! By the way, it's true, everything is better in Firefox. --People of Antioch talk 01:38, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

I dont agree I used ff for a little bit and I didnt like the way it looked, to me it just looked blury --Shadowphoenix 02:28, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

(Edit conflict) I just use it for the ease of use and sparing me the headaches of frequent crashes and https errors. Also, it's a little faster on loading special stuff (like flash), which I look at a lot, so I use ff. --People of Antioch talk 02:30, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

One word: Firebug. Calor 02:47, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

One "word": <3. And then some more words to go with it: Adblock (with the Filterset.G Updater), Live HTTP Headers, Html Validator, del.icio.us Bookmarks. — Galil 07:08, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

+NoScript --  (CoRrRan / talk) 12:21, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Filled up quick

Wow, this filled up quite quickly. — ク Eloc 貢 04:07, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Meh, got larger. Can't fill up, as it can be infinitely expanded. Calor 04:17, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

i like poke's and bexor's dates :) funny coincidence, huh? - Y0_ich_halt 13:50, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

btw. why are people with the same date divided? That is confusing :/ poke | talk 18:33, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

To make it look more appealing --Shadowphoenix 18:34, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Here's a silly question...

Now, let's say someone is born on February 29th, during a leap year. On what day do they celebrate their birthday during the non-leap years? It's a question that's been bugging me for a while. Not to mention, if someone ever fills out that spot on here, it would be nice to know when to say Happy Birthday (as opposed to only doing it every four years). -- Jïörüjï Ðērākō.>.cнаt^ 07:21, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

They're 1/4 the age of everyone else born in the same year, of course. Surely you've seen The Pirates of Penzance. -- Hong 08:38, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

They'd pick either the 28th or the 1st of March. A year is a year, whether or not you get that one day milestone. - Bex 09:27, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Well, my uncle normally uses the 28th. — Ebañy Salmonderiel 21:01, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

It's debateable, I think it's their personal choice (if too young, the parents prolly choose for them). I was thinking about this just this morning. If the person LIKES being born in february (a feb. patriot, if you will...) then they choose the 28th. but to be chronilogically accurate, March 1, the day after the 28th, would be the day they were actually born.- Vanguard 15:05, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Monthly background colors

Is there a rhyme or reason to them? Seems to be all over the place, but surely someone had some logic with the colors, right? Right? - THARKUN 01:01, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Nope. Poke was sleep-deprived when he made that. Calor 01:11, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Always random colors (with similar SB values) without a rhyme and without looking if I already had that color before.. So: No :P poke | talk 06:43, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

I tried to place the birthstone colors on there but it didnt work so well, I was thinking about taking pictures of birthstones adn placing them by each month but I haven't gotten around to it. --Shadowphoenix 15:47, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

That was my first thought, that maybe it was by birthstone color, but that quickly turned out to be false. I wouldn't worry about that, though, frankly; nobody I know cares about theirs, and it will probably just add clutter and confusion. Just pick a scheme of repeating colors or something logical and go with it; heck, just repeat light gray and white. It doesn't have to be snazzy. - THARKUN 19:17, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Because light gray and white are the two most festive colors known to man ;) But we should get a non-drunken color scheme. Calor 19:19, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

The First!

Hey! What good luck! I'll be the first to be celebrating since this project came underway! Just five more hours... time to hit the bars... :P MiraLantis 01:10, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Happy Birthday, if not a bit early! Calor 01:13, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Wow that came quick i havent even finished the birthday thing yet lol, I better get to work XD --Shadowphoenix 02:01, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Lol, it filled up quick. You need any help to speed things up? Calor 02:04, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Yes thanks I will send u the link on ur talk page --Shadowphoenix 02:06, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Ask...

Should we have people put their favorite colors so we could change their birthday box to be special just for them?--♀☺☻ Ninja Dragon 03:32, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

That might be a good idea we need to petition it tho with the other ppl who helped make this page lets ask brains, poke, and calor and see what they think. As for me I support it lol --Shadowphoenix 03:42, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

The box is supposed to be a surprise, in theory, so asking them what color they want kinda kills the surprise. But whatever, do what the community wants. Calor 03:44, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

It is but everyone knos about it now since it was linked to ur page lol, everyone on the wiki has ur talk page on there watchlist lol jk --Shadowphoenix 03:47, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I'm guessing a lot of people do, but probably only five people saw. And the background color doesn't matter a whole lot; I doubt a user will hate the box because it's light yellow instead of, say, a light red. Calor 03:52, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Don't even joke about that! I hate you now! >.> (Okay, maybe not...) — Galil 06:08, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Personally when I think about that box, I think about removing my name from the list :P I prefer a simple text ^^ poke | talk 07:52, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

well if u look under Miralantis' box u will see where I actually typed something. It is not all template. --Shadowphoenix 14:09, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

"Happy birthday" is 100% better than a box, whether it's a template or not. -- Brains12 \ Talk 16:22, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

yep :P poke | talk 18:32, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I'd prefer just so say "Happy birthday" to people, as it seems more genuine than a box, template or not, even if accompanied by a message. Calor 18:34, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Not to be overly critical, but a link to the person who wished it in the title? Seems like the signature covers that. And personally I don't like a pleathora of 'lol's and XDs and the like. The box is spiffy, but if it becomes a template or added by a bot or something, it kinda ruins the fun of it. Just wish them a good day and call it good. But then, I'm something of a minimalist and scoff at a lot of internet memes and norms... so keep that in mind if you care about my opinion. - THARKUN 19:21, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

templates = lose in short. - Y0_ich_halt 20:23, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Ok first things first, what is the big deal about this???? If you didnt notice the box wasnt the only thing I put on there, I have no intintion of making this a wiki wide template it is for my personal use. I put the box there because of the joke in the link if u dint look at it. I really dont see why this is becomin a big deal. As poke said (in so many words) I am no longer hosting this page so that means that whatever I do is on a peronal basis. The template is for me to use no one else (however, I dont mind if you use it). I do not put only the box I also put a personalized text under. I am very confused about why this starting to become such a controversy. --Shadowphoenix 20:39, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

That's good to know, I guess; I think most were just assuming that you were giving the "official" greetings in the sense that it was your idea and then was promoted to a project - which in my mind meant that it became an official greeting from the Wiki (if that makes sense), with you giving the greeting. If you consider it only a convenient organizational method and you are doing all this personally, then fine - and also in that case, do whatever you want. Sorry for the confusion. - THARKUN 20:50, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I think the userbox saying This user hosts the birthday grats page and the birthday team. led me to my conclusion that you were being official in your greetings, fyi. Since the grats page link is to an official wiki project.... - THARKUN 20:54, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Maybe I should put another disclamier telling people that I am no longer hosting this page. Apparently that was stripped from me when it became project lol. Anyway, the page is no longer for an "official" wiki Happy Birthday Message; becuase it was bumped up to a GWW Project. Therefore the template is a personal template. This page is now under the control of the Guild Wars Wiki Community (i.e. everyone). If it is suggested an supported we may make a "official" template, that can be used by anyone, and everyone. But that hasnt happened yet. And for the userbox I just havent removed and/or cahnged it yet. --Shadowphoenix 20:59, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

see, i didn't even notice that userbox. the template sucks anyway, just put the link there manually, or go look for a different one (i, personally, don't like that vid...) XD - Y0_ich_halt 21:01, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I'm not trying to criticize you Shadow (though I admit I did have some negative things to say about your message earlier; sorry for any offense), just pointing out why I was confused and had the idea that your greetings were official. I get it now though.. sorry for the confusion. - THARKUN 21:03, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I love the concept of this idea but I think the Bday template needs to omit the "lol's" and "xD"s, and the self-doubt message, to make it more official and cleaned up. That's just me, though. I have a personal prejudice against people who use "lol" in every sentance when I'm damn sure they're not realling "lolling".- Vanguard 15:07, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

i made a proposal. veulliez have a look. - Y0_ich_halt 19:28, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Very cute!

Nice work, guys. This is super cute :) I'll make sure to pester as many Anet folks as I can and have them add their birthdays onto the list. -- Emily Diehl (talk) 20:40, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Just ask them about there B-day and add them yourself *evil grin* --Fox007 20:44, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

lol XD they'll get some nice template-spammage ^^ - Y0_ich_halt 20:46, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

credit

it's official now, so that section should be removed imo. - Y0_ich_halt 21:08, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

um...may I ask why, I did come up with it and I think I deserve credit --Shadowphoenix 21:12, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

this is a wiki and it's no longer your personal project. it's this wiki's project now, and by submitting it (or allowing to submit it) to mainspace, you kinda accepted that. afaik. - Y0_ich_halt 21:18, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

i.e. you can no longer claim credit, since we, the wiki ppl made it. all hail communism XD - Y0_ich_halt 21:19, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I don't think some credit for the idea does any harm though. - anja 21:21, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

thank u Anja --Shadowphoenix 21:24, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I agree with Anja. Its a wiki project, but the idea was Shadow's. I don't see the problem in listing that. - THARKUN 21:26, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

it's ugly at the bottom, that's all. can't we just put it in the message at the top? :P - Y0_ich_halt 21:52, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

and maybe, just maybe!, i'm a wee bit bored... - Y0_ich_halt 21:55, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I was thinking it hardly mattered, but your change looks better. - THARKUN 21:56, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Just browsed through my log files :P

Jan 30 18:39:30 *	The topic for #gww is: The Initial Unofficial Official Guild Wars Wiki
     channel: http://wiki.guildwars.com/ | we need a birthday list
[...]
Jan 30 18:47:52 <Anja>	who says we need a birthday list btw? :P
Jan 30 18:49:47 <poke>	Hm. <- :P
Jan 30 18:49:59 <Anja>	you did? :P
Jan 30 18:50:05 <Anja>	it's in topic, that's why i'm asking
Jan 30 18:50:06 <poke>	no, but I would say yes now :P
Jan 30 18:50:11 <Anja>	ah :P
Jan 30 18:51:57 <Anja>	it would be nice to have..
Jan 30 18:53:06 <poke>	Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Birthday list ?
Jan 30 18:53:08 <poke>	^^
Jan 30 18:53:15 <Anja>	hahah
Jan 30 18:53:57 <poke>	"Add your birthday to the following list to be spammed with birthday messages then"
Jan 30 18:54:46 <Wynthyst>	Auron did that
Jan 30 18:54:58 <Anja>	the topic?
Jan 30 18:55:02 <Wynthyst>	yes

Credit for Auron then? :P poke | talk 22:03, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I think we owe Auron some sort of cake. LordBiro 22:06, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I am pretty sure lots of people thought of the idea, but i have seen only one record of someone actually going beyond and implementing the idea. Or, are there other birthday lists out there on the wiki?.--Fighterdoken 22:08, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Yes, good point. In fact, I came up with this idea in 1886, and even sent the idea to my aunt, who was visiting her friend Esther Gray, Gaile's great great great great great grandmother, via a telegram. The text is as follows:

.. 
- .... .. -. -.- 
.-- . 
-. . . -.. 
.- 
..- ... . .-. 
-... .. .-. - .... -.. .- -.-- 
-.-. .- .-.. . -. -.. .- .-. 
..-. --- .-. 
- .... . 
--. ..- .. .-.. -.. .-- .- .-. ... 
.-- .. -.- .. .-.-.-

As such, I demand credit as well. In bigger font, too, since I came up with it so long ago.. and am well over 100 years old, based on those dates, and thus can't read all this silly small fonted nonsense. - THARKUN 23:47, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

O..kay... -- Brains12 \ Talk 23:48, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Ironic that I know Morse Code:

I

think

we

need

a

user

birthday

calendar

for

the

guildwars

wiki.

I agree. Calor 02:47, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

lol XD - Y0_ich_halt 15:47, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Yo is right about the removal. Of course everyone has his pet projects that he/she cares about and wants to be credited for. However, there are very good reasons why we generally don't do so. First, there is the history which impartially and accurately shows the contributions everyone made. Then credits would make the wiki cumbersome. Do you really want to read a "invented by UserA, adapted by User B, User C, improved on by User D, User E, minor edits by User User F, User G, User H, User I, User J, ..." on every page and template?

Lastly and most importantly, the wiki works because people are willing to work together and share their contributions to create something better for everyone instead of several faulty personnal versions. Introducing credits goes directly against that spirit.

Don't understand me wrong, Shadowphoenix deserves the praise for starting this, but placing a credit on the article page is the wrong way to go about this. --Xeeron 12:56, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

btw: page credits poke | talk 14:38, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Not to mention before it got moved. — Galil 14:52, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Honestly I dont see how that little line in small print would hurt the page any. Whay not just leave it be? --Shadowphoenix 17:44, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

I tried to point out what exactly is wrong in my post above. Let me try again: Why should only one user be on that credit line? Look at this version you put up, and at this version with much cooler graphics made by poke. Why should you be mentioned and not poke? To be fair, we would have to mention everyone who worked on the article, making the credits as long as they are in the links above. Trying to distinguish between mayor and minor edits would make them longer still.

Wikis are simply the worst location to place credits on. --Xeeron 21:10, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes poke did make the tables and such (which I tried to give him credit for but he wouldnt allow me). But since the page its self was my idea I think I deserve credit (how many times do I have to say it lol). It was originally created by me, honestly I see no harm in adding a little credit for that. Like it says I did take the first step in creating it and I did go so far as to make it an offical project of the wiki, but that does not mean that the credit for me making it should go away (and say what you will but do u honestly think that people are going to dig threw the history to find out who created this page??? Do not lie XD). I really dont see why it is such an issue. --Shadowphoenix 21:21, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Ok then, do you think anybody is interested on who had the idea for that page? It's important that the page is here but not who created it. And for those, who are interested in that, there is the history. poke | talk 21:27, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Why do I keep having to repeat myself? What does it hurt that it is there???? As far as I can see it does not. If people dont care then would it make a difference if it was there or not? And once again, I had the idea, I went so far as to make it I think that I deserve credit it is as plain and simple as that. --Shadowphoenix 21:31, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

I have been pretty active on this wiki (and on guildwiki before), yet you will have a hard time finding any "credits" for me on any pages in the pages in main namespace or GWW namespace. Do you think that is because I never started any? Nor will you find any credits by other users.

It is a shame if I can't explain it to you, but be assured, it is an issue for me at last. --Xeeron 21:32, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Ok so you made some articles and stuff like that right. Ok, no u dont get credit for those, think about it tho I have started the first wiki community related project (not on Guild Wiki btw, just this one), for me that is a pretty big accomplishment; so I think I deserve credit. Once again I repeat myself: I had the idea, I went so far as to create it, I think I deserve credit. Sorry but atm im not budging. --Shadowphoenix 21:39, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

You are all making yourself look silly (hey, probably I'm making myself look silly). A wiki project is not a big accomplishment, this is a game and a past time, not saving the world. From what I understand, common wiki (even community?) practice is that credit is given indirectly. While I understand that you want to be credited, Shadowphoenix, the culture here would actually give you more credit without that name on the page. Do your thing, not for the sake of praise but because you want to do something that's good for the community. Praise comes anyway. - anja 02:38, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

(Reset indent) I'm going to put down my 2 cents on this ridiculous discussion. I think you guys are treating Shadowphoenix unfairly for something as trivial as a bloody birthday list. She did make the page first, so yes, she deserves having her name somewhere on the page. Those who re-designed the page should too. Why not? Because it will give credit to them for having come up with the page? And for taking the trouble of wanting to wish other people happy birthday? If you don't like the word "credit", change it to "contributor" or "the birthday wishers", or whatever makes you happy. Spend time arguing and improving content articles, not a birthday list.

If everyone is dead set on removing the names of the primary contributors from this page, I am pushing for the removal of all the contributor names from Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Armor crafting and collecting, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Collectors, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Events, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Inventory icons, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Mission articles, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/NPC models, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Quests, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Skill trainers, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Trophy project, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Media watch, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Policy Cleanup, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/German translation task force, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Explorable Areas, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Skills, Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Unique Items, and Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/SS/LB/K/L Points.

If those can have names of founding/primary/major/current/secondary/parttime contributors, then so can a birthday list. -- ab.er.rant 05:43, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Hmm, I learned something new today. Shadowphoenix is a girl.

...oh, right. Topic. I also agree with Ab.er.rant on this one; maybe not a "credits" section, that sounds a little too... what's the word... selfish? No, something like that. But a Contributors or Members section would work perfectly; even use it to mention Shadowphoenix originally created the project or something, list off the "official" birthday well-wishers, and so on. Can't take up more then a few lines of text, so it shouldn't be a big deal. Not like it ever was one. -- Jïörüjï Ðērākō.>.cнаt^ 05:54, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

As far as I understand that, Aberrant, the contributor list on project pages show who works actively on that project. It doesn't count as a credit and everybody else is - of course - also allowed to work on that and if they want they can also add themselves to the list to show others that they are interested in the process of that project. poke | talk 06:35, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Project contributor sections are okay. They help identify who to go to in case you need more information on contributing to a project. In this case, the project isn't really a project at all -- it's a single list on a single page, with voluntary signup. This list shouldn't be under projects. It should be at the root level of GWW-space.

Credit sections are not okay. First, we have a built-in mechanic for tracking credits on the history tab. Second, nobody else does this on any other article anywhere. Finally, if that's the case, put a footer with me, Baxter, and Gravewit's name on every page, since we started the GuildWiki which lead to the creation of this wiki which means we're directly responsible for the entire thing.

No, actually, we need to do more than that. Every time anybody edits an article, they should sign their contribution -- even on little grammar fixes -- so that everybody knows who did everything.

Until consensus favors putting credit on articles, leave it out of this article. Follow tradition until decided otherwise, please.

—Tanaric 19:49, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

w/e take off the credit, just leave it be. I am very tired about discussing this. Oh and btw I do think I am being treated unfairly on this, I am very tempted to temp. halt all of my projects if they will cause as much arguements as this one has. The point of these projects are to bring together the wiki community, not cause wiki wide riots. I do have many other projects in the works atm but if they are going to cause this, then I will put them all on hold. I really do not want to do this but if this continues then I guess I may have to, this has made me really re-think realasing my other projects. It is not so much the credit but the fact of the arguments over the credit. --Shadowphoenix 03:14, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

was it really appropriate to remove the credit while the issue was still being debated?.. especially given ab.er.rant's most recent post about other pages with credit listed? I thought unanimity in debates was the usual standard. - THARKUN 03:17, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Good point, the issue is still being debated and I think that should be reverted until we are all done discussing it. --Shadowphoenix 03:20, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Credit doesn't belong. If you want credit, go make your own website and put "copyright 2008 Shadow Phoenix" at the bottom of every page. If you can't live with being credited in the history, you won't ever be happy on a wiki. -Auron 03:31, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Kind of a rude comment but, w/e. oh and btw don't bring the drama of this to my talk page --Shadowphoenix 03:35, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

This sets a VERY bad precedent. I just spent the past 3 hours updating the design a weapon pages from 2005 and 2007 and i haven't put a "credit goes to me" line for that, as its just not important. You work on this wiki for the greater good, not to serve ones ego. If this is let stand, well in theory it could lead to everyone taggying every edit they make with their name at the bottom of the page. If people are interested in who should take credit for the page, they can check the history. -- Salome 03:40, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Credit enough is in the edit history and at the (url)&action=credits location. To aberrant, for the project pages, those people are the contributors. They aren't there so we can say "Oh, so and so is a great person for doing XYZ". The names are there so people can be contacted with questions about the project, or if there is a major update with said project. Everyone in this discussion has created a bunch of pages. Nobody is putting their name at the bottom for credit. Also, where would it stop? Maybe we should put "Credit to Anet for server space"? Or Al Gore for creating the Internet? Sorry, that had to be. But if credit stays there for Shadowphoenix, then I will go back to every article I have edited, and add "Credit goes to Calor for xyz". Obviously, that's not what should happen. And even then, the creation of this page isn't a very huge accomplishment.Calor 03:46, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

First things first, nothin egotistical about it. Second the credit is gone, leave me alone about this I have nothing to do with it any longer, I might say happy birthday to some people, but leave me alone about it. I do not appreciate getting bashed over something like this. --Shadowphoenix 03:58, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

I wasn't bashing you sweetheart just making a point. It wasnt meant to be taken personally as it wasn't an attack on you, it was just highlighting a point. Please Shadow, dont be disheartened by this. The response has been somewhat OTT on this talk page (a wee bit in part to your refusal to let the issue go) but you are a VERY valued member of the wiki community and starting this page was appreciated. Ive been tracking your edits for a bit now and I really hope that you don't get disheartened by this talk page my love, as many of the people here who disagreed with you on this talk page, still really value your work as a contributor to the wiki as a whole.{EDIT: just as an aside Tim Berners Lee created the internet) -- Salome 12:15, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Actually, Tim Berners-Lee created the World Wide Web, not the Internet.Cassie 12:31, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Okay then, DARPA created the internet lil miss picky *grin* This wee offtopic debate kinda also highlights the issue with attributing credit, it can all get very confusing if left unchecked. -- Salome 02:12, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

2 cents: Credit is known just by these talk pages, and anyone who really wants to know where this project came from can just look at the page history and see the changes on "new page" or something. Removing a credit line does not remove credit. Common sense, people.- Vanguard 05:07, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

My rant apparently did nothing to resolve this silly disagreement. As I said before (and this point keeps getting missed despite my multiple emphasis), this is a bloody birthday list. I can't believe how vehemently opposed people are with having the name of the user who came up with the idea of having a birthday list. Tanaric, your stand here and your stand on my talk page appears to be contradictory. But you're right in that this should be moved out of project space. This should have stayed in Shadowphoenix's user space and this wouldn't have happened.

Regardless, I think this argument needs to stop; it's harmful. I propose two ways of resolution:

1. Move this back into Shadowphoenix's user space and leave it at that. For the rest of the projects, move all of it into the user space of the user who started it. Best standing example: User:Gem/Wiki improvement. No more arguments about names on project pages mean. I can't believe no one argued about those names yet when this birthday list came up, complaints started coming in. Geez.
2. Get rid of every single list of contributors. There is no "actively" contributing user. I contribute to certain projects once in a while, so should I periodically add and remove my name from all those projects? No. Get rid of it, all of it. Put in a simple bullet point "News" or "Recent activities" section or something. Project articles cannot list user names. Example: Guild Wars Wiki:Projects/Images needed.

Take your pick please. -- ab.er.rant 01:07, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Neither. There is no issue with voluntary user lists on project articles in GWW-space. There is a problem with article contributors demanding public credit in a manner inconsistent with the rest of the wiki -- we discussed this and most involved appear to agree. Shadowphoenix has withdrawn her claim to public credit on this article, and so this is no longer a problem. —Tanaric 01:12, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Every person who has a birthday listed is a contributor to this project, just like anyone on some other project contributor list is also a known contributor for that project. There's no point listing a name twice (or thrice, seeing as the history is there also, but comparing it with other projects, a list of names on the page seems consistent) with a credits section. No one person created this project, and no one person is the sole maintainer of this project. Everyone who is on this list now has knowledge of its existence, and so is most likely to maintain the project and wish those people a happy birthday. I don't see a difference with this project and any other project - both have contributors, neither have creators. -- Brains12 \ Talk 15:51, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Finally Brains puts in his 2 cents lol, oh and btw this page is starting to get kinda big lol. (notice how I am completely avoiding the point of the converstation) --Shadowphoenix 15:55, 12 March 2008 (UTC)